D4 6U D315 Head question

[WraithGTO]

G'day all

I have just taken the head of the D46U#300 to check for possible Head leaks. I am getting slight bubbling in the radiator and a Burnt diesel fume smell in the radiator, also oil leaking down the outside of the block.

I have a few question if you don't mind please
My head is Number 4F5508 with 1 piece Pre combustion chamber and no glow plugs

1. It looks like I need to replace 2 of the small ferrules and the rubber seals for the large and small Ferrules. Would anyone have a part number for the small ferrules and the 2 sizes of rubber seals please

2. With the exhaust fumes in the coolant, The only possible way I can see it happening is through a Pre Combustion chamber
, the bores show no signs of water and the head gasket has no water tracks in it or cracks, are there any other ways for exhaust to enter the cooling system please?
And would anyone have the part# for 1 piece Pre Com chambers without glow plugs please and the o-rings and gaskets numbers please

3. Is it important to have the water directors in the head, and if so would someone have a Part number for them please.

4. Also a Part number for the head gasket please.

5. is the part # for the Spline tool for the one piece chambers (5F8353)
or is it a different Part#

Sorry to be so long winded and asking for so many part #. I am trying to source a parts manuals for my tractor and hope to find one soon

Regards Simon

[SJ]

I have a highter 6U book but most the parts are the same.Ferrules 3-7B2420 small seals 3-7B2419 and the larger ones 8-6B6224 ferrules and seals 8-6B6225. Head gasket -4F7004 and the head gasket kit from Cat is 2H5080. The director number is 6B6222 and takes 8 of them.Normally the directors never need changing unless they fell out. Also compression can get into the cooling system under the liner ledge and cause bubbles in the cooling system and in time eats the ledge in the block away and causes all kinds of trouble.The only way to repair them is with the liners out is cut the block and install shims thicker to bring the protrusion back to specs. or if they are too bad then there is inserts to install after the block is bored out in that area. The chamber tool I have no number for it in my books.The Cat head gasket kit hs all the ferrule seals and manifold gaskets and valve cover gaskets etc. in it but not the ferrules or directors.The oil leak down the side of the block is normal at times so on the outse of the head gasket put a light coat of #2 perma-tex on it before putting it on and I did that to 100s of engines at the dealer shop and did the trick.The D6 with the D318 engine was a bugger for that problem too, worse than the D4s due I guess to the longer head.

[Old Magnet]

The 5F8353 is the correct tool for the pre-com chambers.
I show a # 2S1273 for the one piece pre-com for the early D315's but be sure to ask if that is the one piece style.
Don't be using the #2 Permatex....appears the formulation has changed and when this new stuff dries it looks like and chips like paint instead of the old pliable stuff. Get the Permatex "Super 300" which does stay pliable. SJ...you need to modify your recommendation.

[SJ]

OM, I didn,t know they had changed the stuff so I,ll make sure I recommend the new stuff as you said. I haven,t bought any for quite a long time as I try to keep some around the house for whatever.I know the old red stuff the # 1 type always got hard after putting it on something. The #2 was always black and stayed pliable so is the new Super "300" black yet too?

[Old Magnet]

Hi SJ,
Color is still black although it looks more brown to me when dried.
Attached specs.

[WraithGTO]

Thankyou very much for the help Old Magnet and SJ. You guys have been a great help as always. I can give Cat a call and ask on the availability of the numbers you guys have given me

With the exhaust fumes in the cooling, Is it not possible for the exhaust to come through a leaky Pre Combustion chamber,?
or is the only possibility the piston liners. I am hoping its just a bad pre com chamber


Cheers Simon

[SJ]

Yes the compression can get to the cooling system if the compression is getting past the metal sealing gasket at the bottom of the chamber.If compression is getting into a cooling system it,s best to do some checking before the head is off. At the shop I made up some testing parts to check down through the chamber by removing the nozzles and then took a hold down nut that holds the nozzle body in and welded a pipe on it and then I could screw it back in the chamber and air test the cylinders one at a time.You need to put it in gear and lock the brakes so it won,t motorize the engine and also the engine has to be on TDC with the valves closed and then with a pressure regulator in the air line you can run it up 75 or 90 lbs. and with the radiator cap off see if you get bubbles from anyone of the cylinders.I have used this on dozens of engines and sure points to the cylinder or cylinders with a problem.Cat did sell a dummy nozzle made of steel to do the test but it isn,t necessary if you make up your own tool with just the nut and the "O" ring seal under the nut.

[WraithGTO]

Thanks for the SJ, that is a great idea. excellent tool

I jumped the gun and already have the head off ,as I had a similar problem 10yrs ago and it was a small pin hole in the pre com chamber .

Once i get it all back together I will make up that great little tool you suggested and see how I go
Thats if it hasn't got a Patent on it

All the parts numbers you guys gave me are available, and I must thankyou again very much for your help

In speaking to the parts guy today , he is not sure if the bottom gasket and the upper o-ring and nozzle o-ring are in the head gasket kit, could I ask you for the parts # please for the o-rings and gaskets for the pre com chambers please.

Old magnet, Just to let you know that the Part number for the pre com chamber that you gave me 2S1273.It is the correct one for the D4 and is a 1 piece chamber without the glow plugs, I had the parts guy confirm it , also I found the old pre com I removed 10yrs ago and it is Part# 2S1273, I new I kept it for a reason

For the permatex 300, None available so far in Perth at the places I have tried and I was told Permatex Australia are out of stock too, They have a aviation type sealer, would that be any good as a supplement or one of there gasket makers?

[SJ]

I checked the book and these are listed, bottom chamber metal gaskets 5B3265 and top chamber seal 2H3088 and nozzle seal 6F1069 and top nut seal is 5B3718. I,m sure they are in the head gasket kit but open it up and see before you leave the dealer.Takes 4 of each one.

[carlsharp]

Wraith-
I have not been able to find the 300 locally either; I have been using the Aviation sealer for years, it makes an especially good thread sealant as well as a gasket maker. The only difference I can see is the aviation is good for about 25 less degrees F and is about a dollar more. Sounds like it will work the same.

http://www.permatex.com/products/Aut..._Sealant_a.htm

http://www.permatex.com/products/Aut...et_Sealant.htm

If you would like to keep some 300 around for next time it can be ordered online from any number of suppliers for about $4 usd.

OM el al if you would like to chew out or ask Permatex why they changed the #2 you can at:
http://www.permatex.com/contact_form...ailCountry=usa

Lets deluge them with emails, then start new thread and share the replies!

CS