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D4 pony engine ?s

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16 years 7 months ago #9301 by dem45133
D4 pony engine ?s was created by dem45133
Any one know how many quarts the pony in a D4 based Trackson Loader is supposed to have. Since I've not seen another pony... I do not know what mods Trackson did. Practically impossible to get at for repairs or linkages etc., I DO KNOW THAT!

Apparently mine has about a foot long vertical pipe (1" dia ID or so) going down to what appears to be some kind of adapter 1" to 2 1/2" or so at the casing for the block... asumme thats where the oil goes... no dip stick or check level plugs visable.. at least that I can find.

Thanks,

Dave M

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16 years 7 months ago #9302 by SJ
Replied by SJ on topic Starting Engine
The operators book says 1 & 1/2 qts. and the parts book shows the dip stick tube coming out the block back by the flywheel at about a 45 degree angle toward the right side of the tractor & the dip stick is inside the tube & has a hand catch to pull it out.The oil drain tube & plug comes out the lower end of the block on the front side of the starting engine block also on the right front corner of it.Yes the fill tube is on top of the engine with a screw on cap & that is the crankcase breather on the bottom under the tube.

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16 years 7 months ago #9303 by dem45133
Replied by dem45133 on topic Thanks SJ
Found it... 98% blocked by loader frame position. When Trackson built this thing they sure "encapsolated" the D4 under it. hard to see/find anything... let along reach it.

Oil has a strong gas smell... and its thin.... only heard this pony run once when we started it to unload from the truck... and believe that was only on one cyl. Who knows how long its been missing on the other.

Going to put new plugs in it and change the oil. Hopefully that will do it. If not I'll have to check the Mag.... but it will be a trick getting to it. So much for integrated engineering (or rather the total lack of it)! Man, and here I thought only the new stuff was like that!

Oh... any one know what the electrical system is supposed to be? Apparently the last battery that was in this was set up as positive ground. It this correct? 12vt or 6vt? Maybe I can see the generator enough to tell what voltage it is. We jumped it direct to the starter (generator and reg not in circuit) with 12 volt.

Sorry guys, haven't been able to afford the manuals yet. So I have to ask you all.


Thanks again.

Dave M

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16 years 7 months ago #9304 by SJ
Replied by SJ on topic Ht4
Dave after you change the oil when you have started the diesel then idle it down & shut the gas off & let the carb. run dry every time you start the diesel till it stalls out then gas won,t seep down in the oil. Originally the HT4s all had a 6V system but who knows what,s been done to it so yes check the generator & starter & if they are 6V then go with that. It should be neg. ground.

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16 years 7 months ago #9305 by 8C 361
Replied by 8C 361 on topic D4 pony engine ?s
Fortunately those ponys dont run good with gas in the oil, it an ruin the engine pretty fast that way. I am sure when you change it you will find it runs fine. Do as SJ says and shut the gas off and run it dry every time you run it.

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16 years 7 months ago #9307 by ccjersey
Replied by ccjersey on topic D4 pony engine ?s
Since it hasn't been run for a while with a battery in it, you should install the new battey and polarize the generator before you run it the first time with the battery in there. That will take care of the former positive ground problem. The battery, generator, regulator and starter really don't care which polarity you use, but they all need to be "on the same page", so to speak, and polarizing the generator will take care of that.

to polarize it, make all the connections and then short between the BAT and the GEN or ARM terminal, just to make a spark, that will do it. Some regulators call the terminal next to the BAT-tery terminal, GEN-erator and some call it ARM-ature, but either way it's the output off the generator and is disconnected from the BAT-tery by the regulator cutout relay whenever generator output is low enough to drain the battery instead of charging it.

D2-5J's, D6-9U's, D318 and D333 power units, 12E-99E grader, 922B & 944A wheel loaders, D330C generator set, DW20 water tanker and a bunch of Jersey cows to take care of in my spare time:D

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16 years 7 months ago #9310 by SJ
Replied by SJ on topic HT4 Start. Engine
8C361 I,ve seen them engines not even start when the crankcase gets flooded with gas.Dave try to run it after you change the oil & see if it runs ok then. If not it might just be the wires too but don,t use nothing but wires with wire in them & not automotive wires.

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16 years 7 months ago #9315 by Old Magnet
Replied by Old Magnet on topic D4 pony engine ?s
The D4 starting engine has a 1-quart oil capacity. It's the D6 that takes 1-1/2 quarts. Do not overfill. Also check the dipstick mark against a 1-quart fill. I have found some to not be correct on the short side and you need the full quart.

Also use the NGK A-6 plug (non-resister type)

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16 years 7 months ago #9323 by SJ
Replied by SJ on topic Oil
OM I just checked some operators books I have & the earlier D315s & others that use that engine do indeed say 1 qt. & the later starting engine book I have for a 933 11A says 1 1/2 qts.so I guess the best thing to do is go by the dip stick. That was what I checked first for the cap. was the 933 11A as it was the first book I grabbed out of the pile I have.

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16 years 7 months ago #9326 by dem45133
Unfortunately I do not have a wiring diagram and the wiring is incomplete.

I'll check the plates for the voltage... likely 6 vt as they look original... but as I said the wiring is incomplete... here is what I have:

1) Broken starter Brass/bronze terminal protruding out the side of the starter that I believe was the type with a right angled lug to bolt the cable to (lug broken off). I drilled a shallow small diameter 5/32 hole and bottom threaded for 10-24. This will allow the wire to be reconncted.

(Apparrently all anyone did with it for quite some time was to jump from an external battery with the positive held on this broken lug and the other on a ground. Thats how they did it when they loaded and delivered it. Took four people to start it... one to spray either... one to hold the jumper connection against the starter lug... one to hold in the pinion drive (not latching) and one to operate the engagment clutch... I need to get it to a one person... me.)

2) A single wire from the regulator coming around the back of the main engine and not connected to anything... but does have an eye connetor. Lug on the regulator is unreadable... I also do not understnd how these old box sytle regulators are wired either. Really do need to figure that out someday...

3) A heavy battery cable (appears to be the larger 6 vt size) apparently last coming from the neg post (due to clamp opening size)... not connected to anything but does have the heavy battery cable eye connector... ending near the starter as it should.

4) A single short ground cable in the battery box to the rear framing/casting (apparently last connected to the positive post... due to clamp opening).

5) A spring loaded "holdin" pushbutton switch near the pony controls which has one terminal grounded... and the other coming from the vacinity of the mag (small gage wire). I assume this to be a mag ground/stop switch... for the pony.

Thats it... Here's what I am thinking:

I assume the main starter switch and any associated bracket is missing... I also assume it was a in line direct contact like the farmall letter series (H, M etc) and others had of this vintage (no relays).

I assume the wire from the regulator would attach to the main feed from the battery and backfeeds through it to charge the battery... But I could esily be wrong. Is this right?

Oh and another quick question.... I assume the small valve on the lower left side of the pony's block( not the head) (as one stands next to the cat to operate the pony engagement) is the fuel shutoff for the pony?

Man I sure could stand some manuals... they're moving further up the buy list though.

Thanks again for all your assistance.

Dave M

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