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Do I have a wet clutch or dry clutch?

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4 months 1 week ago #240689 by G2D2
I have found the starter pinion lube points for the atf think I'll try the  Mercon 3 maybe 1st as slickness is what I think I'm after more than mercon LV(low viscosity) with micro abrasives...
Hoping that it is the same for mine because on the 5 j  seems you can remove the pinion without removing the pony My tractor which is a combination of sorts has the later curved handle.  In the video he say's to pour until it runs out the bottom hole.
 


 
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4 months 1 week ago #240702 by bernie

Have electric start for the pony motor, Each time I try and start it I do hear a little gear noise and after it starts and I pull up the first handle to engage the gear before I engage the diesel motor clutch It grind quite a bit takes me about 3-7 seconds of grinding to slow it down to where I actually can flip the clutch Forward, I take it that is not normal

Maybe I’m out of sync here, but if initially hearing a grinding noise is likely due to clutch not stopping the pinion gears  enough fir them to mesh with the flywheel gear. The ATF I think is better suited to make its way between the clutch discs (I think). The clutch is also a brake.

You may need to work the clutch /brake handle forward and backward just a bit and lightly pull up on the pinion lever at the same time to let the pinion gear turn into alignment with the flywheel gear so they can mesh. When you do this, pull the clutch handle back toward the operators seat to be sure to brake the pinion, which assists with the mesh of gears. If you look in the inspection port on top of the case over the pinion you will see the pinion stop turning if the clutch discs are grabbing during braking. 

After after my D42T clutch / pinion repairs l think I learned that if the pinion disengages too quickly the latches need adjusted by the adjustment screws 1/2 turn each at a time , or latches are worn and need replaced. If pinion is not stopping clutch discs are not properly contacting one another to attain the proper friction to stop the turning for gear mesh. If ATF and latches adjustment aren’t solving, you will likely need to dig into it, inspect l, clean etc. Squatch in his vids shows how to “cone” the discs. I attempted this but seemed to run out of stacking height so I put them back flat. I use ATF. I did not replace my latches fyi.

Have fun,
bernie




 

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4 months 1 week ago #240707 by Jack
I am assuming that the D2 is a 5U series; I first off got the notion that I was dealing with a 5J. They are very similar in the mechanical aspects, but I'm not real sure about some of the details. It is a dry clutch, right? The dipstick pictured is for the transmission, * 80/140 gear oil, right?

There are three plugs on the starter drive case. Top--3/4" pipe-- is filler of course. Bottom--1/4"--is the drain. Change oil when pony is changed. The third plug is below the shaft level and is the oil level plug. Fill to run out here. Pony uses 30W. ATF is ok in the starter drive.

If you or someone before you has been grinding the starter drive into mesh, you might be looking for a new ring gear any time now.

If you have to pull the pony motor, the 5U water passage from the diesel head to the top of the pony is a little double elbow sorta thing that is not hard to manage. It is the seal on the 5J that is hard to find and tedious to position when installed.

Check the easy stuff first.

Jack

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4 months 1 week ago #240711 by Jack
I am assuming that the D2 is a 5U series; I first off got the notion that I was dealing with a 5J. They are very similar in the mechanical aspects, but I'm not real sure about some of the details. It is a dry clutch, right? The dipstick pictured is for the transmission, * 80/140 gear oil, right?

There are three plugs on the starter drive case. Top--3/4" pipe-- is filler of course. Bottom--1/4"--is the drain. Change oil when pony is changed. The third plug is below the shaft level and is the oil level plug. Fill to run out here. Pony uses 30W. ATF is ok in the starter drive.

If you or someone before you has been grinding the starter drive into mesh, you might be looking for a new ring gear any time now.

If you have to pull the pony motor, the 5U water passage from the diesel head to the top of the pony is a little double elbow sorta thing that is not hard to manage. It is the seal on the 5J that is hard to find and tedious to position when installed.

Check the easy stuff first.

Jack
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4 months 1 week ago #240712 by Jack
There is a small cover that can be removed if you take the firewall loose and move it rearward. It is about 45 degrees left of top center of the clutch housing. The latch spring adjustments can be reached through this small hole. If the clutch brake lining is not shot so as to need replacement, you might get by with adjustment. Pulling the pony is a last resort, I am told, because the seal between the diesel and pony cooling systems is sorta unobtainable. (?) That last bit is strictly hearsay.

Also, the spring adjustment screws are supposed to have a cotter pin through the boss where they screw in, running across through the screwdriver slot to keep them from backing out. Don't tighten these screws too much; they will fail to release the starter drive when the diesel starts, which will blow something to small pieces... Adjust them down 1/2 turn at a time until they work right.

Locktite is seldom a bad ideas also.

The starter clutch will work more freely if you use ATF or 5W high detergent oil in this case. Bear in mind that it will gradually be diluted by the 30W passed down from the engine and become thicker.

I have never seen a 5J with a wet clutch. You want to remove that drain plug from the clutch housing and replace it only as long as you are working in water. Same foes for the side clutches.

My D2 5J has been with me for a bit over fifty years. It's a good machine but they need a bit of care to stay that way. I hope this bit is of some help to you.

Jack
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4 months 3 days ago #240774 by G2D2
Thanks Bernie!  I have the 5u 2s dozerI believe? it's missing its serial but around 53' I believe Dry clutch.. Anyway I guess I might have cone instead of discs?  was able to source the srews fron cat thanks to this forum!

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4 months 3 days ago #240775 by G2D2
Thank you Jack you are a mind reader!  Good to know, so mine is 5u I believe, dry main clutch no dipstick.. will be interesting Ill make a video so people can see u vs j pony engagement clutch. Might not if the atf trick works .
 
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4 months 3 days ago #240776 by Rome K/G
The drain is underneath yet next to the engine block and inspection cover in the last pic.
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4 months 3 days ago - 4 months 3 days ago #240778 by G2D2
Thank you! So many there lol, this one on the bottom light blue? 
 
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Last edit: 4 months 3 days ago by G2D2.

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4 months 3 days ago - 4 months 3 days ago #240780 by Rome K/G
Yep! Probably allot of crud in there may have to take a piece of wire and poke in there to get things moving, spray some brake clean in there also, then some gas to flush it out. The oil level plug is the one in front by the governor cover.
Last edit: 4 months 3 days ago by Rome K/G.
The following user(s) said Thank You: kracked1, G2D2

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